Forums Erbium Lasers General Erbium Discussion Gosh what a case

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  • #2803 Reply

    Glenn van As
    Spectator

    Hi folks: Ok here is an osseous case I started in April of this year and today I continued on with it.

    The first two photos are from April and what they are is captured stills from my video that I took as I put my video camera on the scope and these images are stills from the camera.

    The tooth we worked on was the 2nd premolar which was fractured to the gingiva on the palatal so my associate stuck in some temp material til I could treat it.

    I cut back the tissue and the bone. Tissue without water and the bone with water and the hard tissue laser. I did it closed flap , ( I know I know…..will do the next one open flap again) and then prepped the tooth and temporized it with a temp crown .

    Tissue was ragged and we used a post , core for the tooth.

    The diode was used to trough the tissue.

    This is part 1 of the case……next are the good photos I took today for you of working on the first premolar…….it had a real surprise for me.

    Glenn

    Page 1 of osseous recontouring.jpg

    Page 2 of osseous recontouring.jpg

    #6183 Reply

    Glenn van As
    Spectator

    Hi folks: Part 2 took place today when I attempted to do a post and core on the first premolar on a tooth that my long depared associate had done the endo on previously.

    I never looked too close at the tooth prior to removing the temp (decay under it) but there was a perforation……

    Its viewable on the pics. I decided to use the diode at 1.0 watts continous wave to remove the tissue in the perf hole. I then placed a post and after curing it I placed some MTA in the hole and then after removing excess carefully at high mag, and blotting of the excess water with pellet , I decided to risk it and go ahead and cover it up. I have never had it not set up when using the laser to remove tissue, stop the bleeding and sterilize the area.

    I placed flowable Dyract GI compomer overtop and cured. Re etched , bonded and buildup occurred.

    Then used the diode at 1.5W 15 Hertz to try and trough and controlled the oozing.

    The healing on the osseous was ok but not stellar but then again neither is her OH stellar.

    I placed temps on both teeth and will insert the crowns in two weeks.

    I thought it was cool to use the laser to remove the tissue in the perfed area…..something I havent seen even my good buddy…….the inimitable Bob Gregg do.

    I hope he doesnt now tell me ………hey Glenn , I did that in 1993 ( I know he will)

    Only once do I want to do something he hasnt done before.

    I will post the final pics after I am done and I do apologize for the pics in the first part but this was all I could do to get something from the video (captured stills)

    All the best…………

    Glenn

    PS , I know under ideal circumstances I should have let the MTA set for 24 hours with a moist cotton pellet so I will take the blame if it doesnt work.

    cya

    Glenn

    Resize of Premolar pg 1.jpg

    Resize of Premolar pg 2.jpg

    Resize of Premolar pg 3.jpg

    Resize of Premolar pg 4.jpg

    #6181 Reply

    2thlaser
    Spectator

    Glenn,
    Great use of lasers, and restoratives, clap clap clap clap! MTA should work wonderfully there. I have used it in similar places. You know, I did something like this in 1989 on a good buddy of mine in Chicago, but no laser!
    It is still in his mouth…really cool case. Thanks for reminding me about this type of modality. I forget once in awhile all the real cool things we can do with our lasers. Great great case!
    Mark

    #6184 Reply

    Glenn van As
    Spectator

    Hi Mark: great to see you around. Still havent registered for the microdentistry course but will look into it next week.

    What did you do for your friend to get the tissue out…..a bur??

    I always find the tissue to be in the hole and I love using the laser ( I have done this a half dozen times now) for removing the soft tissue and getting a dry clean sterile hole for the MTA. I have heard people say the MTA wont set on occasion and I think it is the blood. It sets fine in water but I am not sure about blood but perhaps it is the moisture as well.

    Well now that I have reminded you ( I am glad one person has done this) I hope Bob Gregg says ……..HEY that is a cool idea. Then I can rest in peace.

    Gonna go post a cool occlusal I did this week.

    Thanks Mark, looking forward to meeting you in August and look for a laser case in Dental town this month.

    Glenn

    #6182 Reply

    ASI
    Spectator

    Hi Glenn,

    The WOW factor is just so unreal with the scope. I continue to be in awe of the details that the scope provides. To share the progress and the process of the treatment with the patient and staff through the scope is just an amazing adventure. It just makes dentistry so much more fun to do.

    Thanks again.

    Andrew

    #6185 Reply

    Glenn van As
    Spectator

    Hi Andrew: the scope does offer alot of wows doesnt it. Its so strange that after we practice for so long that when we start using the scope for the first while it seems like we have to learn all over again what we are looking at.

    I enjoy seeing the excitement that the scope generates because I at times have become ho hum about it after using it routinely for so long.

    Its nice to see that how I feel about the scope isnt unique.

    Thanks for corroborating my mad ideas!!

    Cya and take care

    Glenn

    #6191 Reply

    Robert Gregg DDS
    Spectator

    Hey Glenn,

    Doing it and showing like you have done here are two different things. Anything I might have done doesn’t mean much until someone actually shows (shares) it being done……Excellent presentation!

    I like how your tissue looks with this diode better than the argon. What do you think?

    Bob

    #6186 Reply

    Glenn van As
    Spectator

    Hi Bob…….you know I was just admiring your work right.

    I am going to compare the 810 diode to the 980 diode which I am getting loaned for a couple of weeks to shoot video and pics for people. I have always been interested in Mike Swicks high fluency technique with water to see how it compares to a standard diode.

    I like what the 810 does and it does cut a little nicer than the Argon (less tissue tags) not as deep penetrating I think but then again until recently i was using all the lasers in CW (except the erbium of course).

    I dont know how pulsing the laser will work.

    Maybe if I get multiple crowns in a row I will do one with
    erbium, another with Argon, 810nm and 980nm.

    I wonder how the healing will work for them……..

    Just an interesting idea huh.

    They all will heal but will any heal better??

    Thanks Bob and all the best.

    Glenn

    #6188 Reply

    Kenneth Luk
    Spectator

    Hi Glenn,

    I’ve been troughing with gated pulse at 4-6 w with irrigation with 980.
    I tried one recently with 1w cw.
    Here’re the post-op views of the tissues.

    Gated pulse 4 w with irrigation
    Tissue was inflammed pre-op
    inf interprox01.jpg inf interprox02.jpg

    1w cw without irrigation
    interprox. cw.jpg

    With higher power and irrigation, there’s no smell of charring on the fiber.
    With 1w cw , I moved the fiber pretty quickly but still get a bit of burning smell. I suppose the suction took care with most of it.

    Wish I have a mic to capture better pictures!

    Ken

    #6187 Reply

    Glenn van As
    Spectator

    Hey the pics look great in my eyes. I dont see much of a difference kenneth in the two pics. Clinically they look the same!!

    Nice pics and nice dentistry

    All gold crowns for both??

    Cya and thanks……….your pulse for the high fluency technique was 10W at .05 on and .05 off??

    Cya and thanks.

    Gonna do some 980 work tomorrow as I will have one to take video and photos for a couple of days starting tomorrow, so it will be fun to play for a day or two.

    Wish I had a bunch of crowns in a row..

    Do 1 with 980 nm
    one with Argon
    one with 810 and the last one with Erbium.

    You would figure out the Erbium (bleeding often) but wonder if others would figure out the Argon vs 810 etc.

    Might be fun to try………

    now if I had a periolase I could almost do a full arch huh…….

    Grin (now will a diagnodent trough to if I gate it Bob??

    just kidding…………..

    Glenn

    #6190 Reply

    Robert Gregg DDS
    Spectator

    Hi Glenn,

    Yep, we need you to be able to document an entire arch. Just need Gord to tell us how to get a PerioLase into Canada……:confused: AND you down for training :cheesy:

    Bob

    #6189 Reply

    Kenneth Luk
    Spectator

    Hi Glenn,
    For the inflammed gingivae, I used 4w .02on/.03off. with irrigation; Slow movement.
    For the healthy gingivae, I tried with 1 w cw no irrigation. Much quicker movement.
    I’m still trying with different power and settings.
    Ken

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